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Tyrn, The Dragoon

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1Tyrn, The Dragoon Empty Tyrn, The Dragoon Thu Nov 08, 2012 12:06 am

667v2



STR Hero

He is an elf, adorned in dark azure armor, decorated with sparse spikes. His helmet is forged to resemble a dragon skull. He is armed with a heavy lance, which he may wield with one hand or two. His Wyvern Familiar is his soul bond, they are connected at the heart and mind. The Wyvern is only two meters long and is more agile than beefy. The Wyvern is a faint golden color.

Str: 24 + 2.8
Agi: 20 + 2.1
Int: 16 + 1.6
Base Damage: 55-70
Base Armor: 3
Base Movementspeed: 320
BAT: 1.7
Range: 300 (But melee based, yes this is codable, the only purpose of this is regarding orb effects and the like.)

Tyrn is a tanky semi carry, meant to be active by level 11 with minimal items needed to do so.

Skills:
1. Call Wyvern

Summons Tyrn's bonded wyvern familiar.
Manacost: 200
Cooldown: 180s

When Call Wyvern is used, the Wyvern Familiar that is summoned starts out at base stats. Every 30 seconds the Wyvern powers up, it takes 180 seconds for the Wyvern to reach full power (max stats). HP gained this way is added on (but not healed). If the Wyvern moves further than 600 units away from Tyrn, it immediately reverts to base stats. When the Wyvern returns to within 600 units of Tyrn, it immediately regains full stats, but does not recover its' missing hp.

Wyvern Familiar:
Base hp 300/400/500/600
Max hp 600/900/1200/1500
Base damage: 20/30/40/50
Max damage: 35/45/55/80
Movement speed: Tyrn's + 10 (affected by boots, haste, yasha etc, changes in real time, not when summoned)
Attack speed: Average
Attack Range: 400 (ranged)
Armor: 0/1/2/3
Bounty: 25/50/75/100

Wyvern Familiar abilities:
Combat Form
Healer Form
(stance changes)
Stance change cooldown: 60 seconds.

Combat:
If the Wyvern is within the 600 bond radius to Tyrn, the Wyvern will automatically use a damaging fire breath attack in the direction of Tyrn's target whenever Tyrn uses 'Jump' or 'Drakesbane', damaging enemy units in its path
Damage type: Magical
Cooldown: 30/25/20/15
Damage: 50/100/150/200
Aoe: cone 500 units in front of Wyvern (cast range is Wyvern's 400 attack range)

Healer:
If the Wyvern is within the 600 bond radius to Tyrn, the Wyvern will automatically use a healing light breath attack in the direction of Tyrn target whenever Tyrn uses 'Jump' or 'Drakesbane', healing allies in it's path
Cooldown: 30/25/20/15
Heal: 50/100/150/200
Aoe: cone 500 units in front of Wyvern (cast range is Wyvern's 400 attack range)

2. Jump
Jumps to the target, hitting it with his lance, ministunning, and binding the target, then returns to his original position.
Single target
Cooldown: 30s
Manacost: 100/110/120/130
Cast range: 500/600/700/800
Damage: 90/140/190/250
Damage type: physical
Ministun for .01 seconds
Bind duration: 1.25/2/2.75/3.5
(Bind works like root, no movement, no invis fading, and no blinking for the duration of debuff, target can attack and cast spells during this period)

Note: Jump is granted as a buff on Tyrn and acts as blink, it can disjoint projectiles when used such as ranged attacks and thrown stuns. The animation for jump lasts 1 second.

3. Drakesbane
Using the secret art of his order, Tyrn thrusts into the target 3 times with his lance, splashing the damage in a 200 width line directly behind his target. Upon conclusion, all effected units are knocked back 150.
Single target
Cooldown: 30/25/20/15
Manacost: 100/85/60/50
Cast range: 300
Splash distance: 300/400/500/600
knockback: 70/100/130/200
Damage: physical damage. 3 hits of: Tyrn's damage + 30/40/50/70
Critical hit chance: 15% per hit
Critical hit damage: 1.5x per hit

Note: damage is calculated as 3 seperate rolls, but dealt in one animation so neither Tyrn nor the target is stalled in one place. The ability still counts as 3 instances of damage (i.e. if Lanaya had 2 refraction charges up, she would only recieve damage from the final hit). That being said, if a unit that isn't being target was moving at extremely fast speeds in the splash radius, it may only be hit by one or two or zero instances of splash behind the chosen target.

4. Spirit Surge
Tyrn infuses his Wyvern into himself, temporarily adding it's power to his own.
cast range: self
Manacost:200/175/150
Cooldown:200/180/160
Duration: 30/40/50
HP: adds 20%/40%/60% of Wyvern's current hp.
Damage: adds 20%/40%/60% of Wyvern's current base damage.
Attack speed: Reduces BAT to 1.4
Refreshes cooldowns of 'Jump' and 'Drakesbane'

Note: Consumes Wyvern Familiar.
Note: Wyvern Familiar may not be resummoned during this duration.
Note: If Wyvern is dead when used, no stats are gained, but 'Jump' and 'Drakesbane' are still refreshed.
Note: HP is added to Tyrn's current hp. i.e if Tyrn has 1000/1000hp, and Wyvern would add 500 hp, Tyrn's new hp is 1500/1500 for the duration of the skill. If Tyrn's hp is 100/1000hp, and Wyvern would add 500 hp, Tyrn's hp will be 600/1000hp after the skill is used, resulting in no addition to max hp.

2Tyrn, The Dragoon Empty Re: Tyrn, The Dragoon Thu Nov 08, 2012 11:49 am

86248Diamond


Admin

This is such an interesting hero!!!!
His jump seems like it would be a bit annoying for the enemy team, especially if he jumps to cancel a tp and then is able to run away, that seems awesome.
But I do assume you can use your 2nd and 3rd skill together, right??

Also, will it still jump if an enemy moves into fog? what about a BKB?

https://86248diamond.forumotion.com

3Tyrn, The Dragoon Empty Re: Tyrn, The Dragoon Thu Nov 08, 2012 12:03 pm

ScreenguardGuy



Ooh, I do love a hero with a good summons. I'd make the wyvern magic immune at level 2 or something, otherwise he is just going to fall down later in the game, particularly with good ultimate's flying around, and I'd double the bounty. Moar gold for da farmers!

Looking forward to seeing some lore though, I do love a good story. Keep up the great work man!

4Tyrn, The Dragoon Empty Re: Tyrn, The Dragoon Thu Nov 08, 2012 1:29 pm

667v2



His jump would work a bit like Ember Spirit's sleight of fist, doing the damage then reverting to his location, however unlike Xin, he cannot use his other abilities during jump because the jump animation will take 1 second, making Tyrn 'invincible' for the duration like storm's ball lightning. The skills are physical damage therefore they will harm a bkbed target, however jump will work like any other physical single target, if started before bkb it will activate, but no debuffs will be placed (only damage). If target is bkbed, jump cannot be cast on them. The jump will follow enemies into fog as long as it was cast when you were in range/had vision.
Drakesbane however can be cast on magic immune targets because it is just a physical damage nuke with no magical effects.

You would want to level your wyvern and jump early for insane damage ganks, (that wyvern hits hard and so do you). Drakesbane is more of a lategame steroid skill because of its damage upgrade, splash, and crit chance. Early on you'd probably only get 1 level for a knockback.

The wyvern should have a 25% base resistance to magic like heros, but a magic immune wyvern would be too strong early. (1500 hp at lvl 7 if you chose to lvl it first). Lategame your wyvern will almost always be surged into the dragoon making him a carry, while early game Spirit Surge is more like an emergency heal/refresh on your jump for chasing etc. Keep in mind he is a str hero with really bad int gain, so he will have mana problems.

As for bounty, it's either really easy to kill or really hard. Spirit Bear only gives 100.. Visage's as well. I think 100 for level 4 is good, because a single venge stun or something can nuke down an early wyvern if the player is careless.

I'll work on lore and stuff later, busy with halo >.> im surprised i put the effort to post this so soon.

5Tyrn, The Dragoon Empty Re: Tyrn, The Dragoon Fri Nov 09, 2012 3:08 am

HeroCommentGuy



To my knowledge Doom is the only melee hero with added range and he possesses only 22 more range than normal. This doesn't even compensate for his low movement speed, negative base armor, and extremely slow attack animation.

Additionally, only spirit breaker and chaos knight even compare to the base damage of this hero. So I think for simple balance reasons it would be smarter to keep him melee range and lower his base damage. As it stands right now his auto attack alone is lane winning.

Other than that this reminds me of a much more interesting concept of a lancer type hero I had in mind. Good stuff!

6Tyrn, The Dragoon Empty Re: Tyrn, The Dragoon Fri Nov 09, 2012 1:54 pm

667v2



300 range is hardly lane winning, I don't see bat auto attacking his way to a lane victory. As for the attack modifiers, ursa used to have the 128 or whatever the exact number is for melee range and have his attack classified as 'ranged' just to keep vlads and battlefury off him. (I asked mechanics forum on pd many years ago if it was possible to have a sven with invoker range and they said sure) (Also if you go into wc3 ladder custom games and put an orb on your blademaster, who is a melee unit, he gets ranged attacks vs air when he has an orb).
His base damage isn't as high as you make it out to be either, a good portion of melee heros are within the 50-60 range, most around 56 but many in the 60 range as well. Phantom Lancer himself goes 45-67 with an agi growth that eclipses Tyrn's STR growth, in addition to having his own escape ability.
If CK and SB get high base damage, why shouldn't another hero be added to the pool? CK already wins 90% of his lanes >.>

7Tyrn, The Dragoon Empty Re: Tyrn, The Dragoon Fri Nov 09, 2012 8:57 pm

HeroCommentGuy



The reason is because he is a very fast, tanky, high damage melee hero. Basically better than CK in that regard but also with more than twice CK's range. Melee heroes already get certain buffs to make them competitive in lane. You could grab a stout and your harass would be better than a ranged hero and your last hitting would be top notch.

While PL and CK have decent damage, PL is squishy as all hell with a crappy escape mechanism and CK burns tons of mana to get a few hits off.

Basically you have the best of all worlds here.

Let me compare you to Syllabear, since you have a minion to harass with as well. Sylla is an extremely potent laner.

Compared to the bear, Wyvern is comparable in damage, half as tanky, but faster (Until synergy is leveled up) and ranged. Very close in abilities until significant levels and items factor in as the bear can utilize items.

Compared to Syllabear the hero, Tyrn is melee, so he loses less experience from denies and gets a stronger stout shield. Additionally his last hits are easier without a projectile speed to worry about. Syllabear is ranged, but he only has 250 more range to work with.

Tyrn is 5 ms faster, has 163 more base health, has a reliable ensnare, does 20 more base damage on average (Almost an entire phase boots), and has only slightly less armor.

Any competent player would outlane the crap out of Syllabear.

8Tyrn, The Dragoon Empty Re: Tyrn, The Dragoon Sat Nov 10, 2012 2:27 pm

667v2



The problem with the wyvern for harass is that a very easy counter to it would be simply to lure it out of Tyrn's bond range, making it lose hp, and killing it. You've gotta be really skilled to harass safely with it and last hit with your hero (without hoping for auto finishes), I believe a bear can win a 1v1 lane against Tyrn, his summon is just more annoying. Though I may be overestimating creeps as a threat, I mean, you make it sound as if this guy hits level 5 and steamrolls over sylla like a viper vs a melee, but I think it's rather dangerous for him with a short range chasing after a bear in lane.

CK and him are the same in my eyes for laning. Both are quick and strong, the only difference is the ranged attack. Both are heavily reliant on mana. I just think that something like a sd will give him too much hell to do anything in lane. aa can keep him from last hits. Very good support heros (that is, often picked and useful) can make laning pretty horrible for him. If it's a solo lane, ta will walk all over him, voker will snap him out of lane, qop will dagger harass all day. He doesn't have anything over ranged heros at all. that 250 range extra on bear gives him so many more seconds to react and get away from ganks and the like, it's like laning a sniper against a trax, that sniper should easily push trax out of lane.

9Tyrn, The Dragoon Empty Re: Tyrn, The Dragoon Sat Nov 10, 2012 3:00 pm

HeroCommentGuy



I've already given my points and you've ignored them. It's CK with less mana problems, nearly Zeus range, melee properties, and for all intensive purposes Syllabear's bear while laning. He can deal half of a QoP's shadow strike in auto attack damage when she goes to use it. I'm not replying anymore if you think this is still fair.

10Tyrn, The Dragoon Empty Re: Tyrn, The Dragoon Mon Nov 12, 2012 12:49 am

667v2



And I've given my rebuttals to your points, I have not ignored them. I do not believe that a ~20 ms nerf and a ~20 damage nerf on him would make him any weaker. That was your point was it not? Hitting 50-60 (placing him in average range) would not address any of his issues that you've stated. Moving at 300 instead of 320 makes him want to get drums, he's still doing what you've said. It would just put him back into the average with all the other heroes in there. But why shouldn't he stand out? And don't use Zeus as an example, no one autos with him for last hits, at least not in a lane against a competent player.

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